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cuzoftheeast 9:46 Fri Aug 26
For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Did he not spot that none of the midfielders actual made themselves available for the ball

We had two zones - forwards and defenders


Valencia?????
Ginge???

I thought the days of alvin Martin and les sealey up front were over

Sir Alf 5:11 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Baggins - agree he has been good at it in a lot of games but...

the " box to box, break up play, put in tackles, break at pace, cover ground, nick the odd goal"

He does have a lot of games where all that goes missing. Its just my opinion, that when we play better teams and are without the ball his game suffers. I suppose he is like a striker with poor service. Will be interesting to look at yesterday's stats. How many interceptions, tackles and breaks at pace he made. I could well be wrong (often am) but my perception is that he goes missing too often when we are having a bad day and yesterday his passing and control let us down. He was not alone but is one of the poorer technicians we have. Again only IMO. :-)

Infidel 5:05 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

chim

Bony would not be clever at this point.

Zaza is an Italian international and fits the bill, exactly what we were looking for.

Calleri is just behind him, with Ayew and AC to come back from injury. Then there's Fletcher, which makes five strikers already ( I discount Valencia and Sakho for obvious reasons).

We have enough strikers now - Bony would be overkill.

chim chim cha boo 3:38 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

I'm sure there's something going on we're not party to. Valencia IS supposed to be a striker and seems to put them away for Ecuador. We all know it's not worked out for him but a goal against Chelsea or Man City (or even fucking Astra) would have made other clubs sit up and think about buying him. I can see why he's started but it's been a gamble that has failed. Gambles sometime do fail.

Tore is a player Bilic has pushed for so I can see why he's played him. He probably thinks it's just a case of him getting fit and up to speed but he's been awful bar the cross in the Europa game.

Antonio at right-back was to accommodate Tore and Antonio has responded perfectly by giving a couple of goals away at right-back and scoring when played in his proper position. It couldn't be more cut and dry. He's not a defender. Also, Bryam has looked great, a perfectly decent right-back who likes to bomb on- exactly what Bilic wants.

Bilic is one of the most intelligent managers we've ever had. He's now got to hold his balls and leave Tore out of the team for a while, until he settles in England and shows his best in training. Maybe throw him on as a sub from time to time.

It's really simple. Our best right side is Byram and Antonio. Sometimes intelligent people over-think and overlook the obvious. I love Bilic and I'm sure he'll do the right thing. When we've got everyone fit we've got a very decent team. Get Valencia off the wage bill, hopefully get another decent right-back as cover and get our play-makers back fit and we'll be fine.

Of course as fans we can be greedy because it's not our money but I'd still love Wilfred Bony on loan.

Baggins 3:02 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

"Then there is Kouyate. When he is not on the ball, he is not doing enough for me."


I just don't get this criticism of the bloke. He's been one of our best players in the last few months. He's not in the team to be a Jan Molby type player, he is there to get box to box, break up play, put in tackles, break at pace, cover ground, nick the odd goal. Which he does very well.

Sir Alf 2:13 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

yep :-)

Its why we cannot retain the ball against the better teams. And why it will take a lot more investment to get into the top 6. Not sure our owners think that or want to.

Just an opinion and probably a statement of the obvious :-)

JustAFatKevinDavies 2:08 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

so Alf, what your saying is our centre backs aren't quite a comfy on the ball as their 50mill a pop centre backs?

cheers for that

Sir Alf 1:59 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Infidel 12:31 Mon Aug 29

Agree with the ball retention issue. It goes back a long way to before the Fat Man even.

We do need more work from some players and especially the wide men and better movement in central midfield and a player playing behind the front two.

But watching this season there are glaring technical issues with several players and central defence is where it starts. Technical meaning being comfortable on the ball,having excellent control and first touch and passing / awareness.

Valencia, Collins, Reid and Kouyate are the most deficient in this respect and in that order. When you watch the City, United, Chelsea, L'Arse and even Pool players they do not hook it into row Z when chasing back unless they really have to. Reid and Collins do it by default. Bilic may be coaching them to do so or accepting that the risk of them trying to pass out from the back is too much? Same as Kouyate. Great on the ball and good in the air against some teams and when he runs with it and uses his physical strength and pace but he essentially just boots it forward and runs after it. Kouyate is a converted CB and it shows at times. He has struggled to get in games because he is not a player who puts his foot on it or looks up to distribute. He runs onto things. But in games where you are against a good passing team and want to keep it you need plenty of movement and the majority of the team to have good control and passing, and awareness. We do not.

Payet, Lanzini, Noble (slower but still good technically) and possibly Ferghouli have the technique as does Ogbonna and Arthur even Cresswelland to a lesser extent Byram. But 5 or 6 with very good technique is not enough and made worse by the lack of movement from the front men or inability to hold it up. Then there is Kouyate. When he is not on the ball, he is not doing enough for me. Not so much of an issue when Payet and Lanzini are about and he is still an asset to the squad but not sure longer term that he is enough of a good footballer in the middle for us to progress?

Same with the CBs Collins and Reid. Oxford and Burke I am hoping have better technical skills. Oxford definitely but needs to up the physical side of his game. Burke not so sure but seems an upgrade technically and have not seen him at CB (his preferred position) to know if he is physically ready?

Long story short, as good a player as the likes of Reid, Collins, Kouyate and some others are, we will need better technical players to retain the ball. IMHO of course.

ragingbull 1:37 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

The fact of the matter is that we had two games before the international break,one was very winnable he fucked them both up.

Infidel 12:31 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Despite the excellent season we had last year one persistent problem we had was ball retention,

We gave the ball away all the time last season, cheaply and stupidly, with poor passing. The passing was poor because there are so few options for the player on the ball - he looks around for a team mate, sees no one there and then gets closed down by an opponent and has to get rid of it somehow.

That hasn't changed this season. We still have a real problem keeping possession when we are attacking and moving up the field. Other teams are far better at keeping their passing crisp and precise. They create more chances because they keep the ball.

My own conclusion is that the work rate of the team isn't anywhere near high enough. They need to be running of the ball all the time. That was a critical factor in Leicester's success last season - the sheer athleticism of their team was breathtaking.

There are obvious exceptions at West Ham - Antonio works his socks off - but the majority don't cover enough ground. And some of them - like Valencia - are shockingly lazy.

This is going to cost us a lot of points this season if we don't fix it. The players need to be fit, sharp and athletic. They need to put in a shift and make themselves available every time we have the ball. Otherwise we will end up hoofing the ball into no man's land or seeing these frustrating mis-hit passes that go straight to an opponent and put us on the back foot.

claretandbluedagger 12:28 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

It's a good thing most football fans aren't actually managers. Imagine if managers were so knee-jerk after a couple games, it'd be awful.

Mad Dog 12:23 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

He's made a few "interesting" choices this season. However let's get some perspective.

We've played Chelsea and man city away. They have money to burn.potential champions

We have several key players out. Basically the majority of our attacking threat.

Despite being under the kosh we came close to sneaking a result against both. And both should have had a player sent off.

Our home game was a banana skin, and whilst not a good game we got away with it. Again with a ridiculously depleted team.

The team will adapt to playing at the new ground. This can be tricky for many teams when they change grounds.

We have lanzini back now, payet almost ready, zaza ready to go. Feghoili, carroll, ayew, and Cresswell to return.

This could have been a lot worse.

Yesterday billic made a mistake in the first half. In the 2nd he replaced tore with byram and antonio pushing forward vastly improved the team. Until reid went off after the elbow it looked like we could nick a point.

Things will be fine.

oioi 12:19 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

moorethanjustananon 12:12 Mon Aug 29

Agreed.

Knocked out of Europa by Astra too. Virtually the same start but with a few additions to the squad. Watford game will tell us a lot.

13 Brentford Rd 12:19 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Odd that moorethan, we also
lost in the Euro qualifying round to Astra.

moorethanjustananon 12:12 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Last Season first 3 games we played the eventual runners up, champions and Bournemouth - 3 points.

This season first 3 games we have played what could very well be the eventual runners up, champions and Bournemouth - 3 points.

On another day we could very well have snatched and albeit very flattering couple of points from our two tough away fixtures, we were by no means good but my gosh there is no shame getting turned over at either Chelsea or City.

Seem to remember the same hysteria last this time last year, given we have over half of our first XI and bench out through injury the start this year is arguable better in comparison to last.

Let's just chill out and see how the results over the next 8 weeks pan out before getting too concerned about our manager making do with his currently depleted squad.

Scraper 11:46 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Hope he takes some holiday right now.
He's knackered.

JustAFatKevinDavies 11:45 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Bilic is the least of my concerns about our club at the moment tbh

BRANDED 11:40 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Not a great start but without our creative players and strikers even I might make a couple of mistakes.

mentor 11:38 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

He's made so many fuck ups it's become more than a concern.

Vexed 11:21 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

Tough start but we have been dreadful every game so far. Slav could help himself a bit by fucking wising up to the really obvious stuff, Antonio at right back costs us at least a goal a game. Tore is completely ineffective on the right wing. Valencia is a total write off. Not playing our best CB pairing makes life difficult for us. Its just idiotic.

Coffee 11:15 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

13 Brentford Rd 10:58 Mon Aug 29

The early BFS/Nolan similarity seems to be with Tore. Bilic is trying to find a way to play him, but that involves messing around with Antonio and others. Don't worry, he'll get it sorted out soon enough.

Baggins 11:04 Mon Aug 29
Re: For the first time - bilic was my biggest concern yesterday

We've had a very tough start, including two away games to teams with title winning aspirations.

We have our entire first choice attack injured.

Let's just calm down a little bit. It's a long season and there is a long way to go.

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